Photo of Valerie Johns, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Valerie Johns
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA, MFT
Verified Verified
Hermosa Beach, CA 90254  (Online Only)
We seek therapy for so many reasons: relationship challenges, physical pain, parenting, isolation, depression, anxiety, career. Sometimes it's just hard to live with uncertainty. I work with all kinds of addictions and intimacy challenges. I treat people of all ages who are going through life transitions: graduations, marriage, new baby, career changes, divorce, illness - while others are athletes and artists wanting greater achievements. Many are grieving or just needing someone to listen. Together, we can determine what kind of therapy will work for you.
We seek therapy for so many reasons: relationship challenges, physical pain, parenting, isolation, depression, anxiety, career. Sometimes it's just hard to live with uncertainty. I work with all kinds of addictions and intimacy challenges. I treat people of all ages who are going through life transitions: graduations, marriage, new baby, career changes, divorce, illness - while others are athletes and artists wanting greater achievements. Many are grieving or just needing someone to listen. Together, we can determine what kind of therapy will work for you.
(424) 327-9157 View (424) 327-9157
Photo of Atalie Abramovici, Marriage & Family Therapist Associate in Los Angeles County, CA
Atalie Abramovici
Marriage & Family Therapist Associate, MA, LMFT
Verified Verified
2 Endorsed
Los Angeles, CA 90066
I specialize in anxiety, depression, self-esteem, relationship struggles, trauma, grief, and life transitions.
As a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist with a deep understanding of mindfulness, the significance of culture and language, and the intricacies of intrapersonal and interpersonal relationships, I aspire to help you explore yourself, maximize your wellbeing, and cultivate tools and practices that propel you to lead a life you love living.
I specialize in anxiety, depression, self-esteem, relationship struggles, trauma, grief, and life transitions.
As a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist with a deep understanding of mindfulness, the significance of culture and language, and the intricacies of intrapersonal and interpersonal relationships, I aspire to help you explore yourself, maximize your wellbeing, and cultivate tools and practices that propel you to lead a life you love living.
(424) 226-5684 View (424) 226-5684
Photo of The Couples Therapy and Reunification Counseling, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
The Couples Therapy and Reunification Counseling
Marriage & Family Therapist, MS, LMFT
Verified Verified
Downey, CA 90241
At The Couples Therapy and Reunification Counseling practice we offer a custom approach for each of our clients! We specialize in working with couples and court ordered reunification cases by using evidence-based practices. We start with understanding where you are now and the challenges you are facing. We then help you move forward by collaboratively working on a plan that best suits you, with support and thereafter celebrating each success with you. We offer an inclusive, safe space, trustworthy, non-judgmental environment, where you can be your authentic self!
At The Couples Therapy and Reunification Counseling practice we offer a custom approach for each of our clients! We specialize in working with couples and court ordered reunification cases by using evidence-based practices. We start with understanding where you are now and the challenges you are facing. We then help you move forward by collaboratively working on a plan that best suits you, with support and thereafter celebrating each success with you. We offer an inclusive, safe space, trustworthy, non-judgmental environment, where you can be your authentic self!
(323) 621-3765 View (323) 621-3765
Photo of Stacy Knupfer, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Stacy Knupfer
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA, LMFT
Verified Verified
3 Endorsed
Hermosa Beach, CA 90254
I am trained in Emotionally Focused Therapy, a modality that helps couples restore intimacy and closeness by re-building loving and secure relationships.
Everyone has battles to fight and hurdles to overcome. Whether you struggle with anxiety, depression, self-esteem, marital issues, parenting concerns, or anything else--you should know that there is a better way to manage your life. Supporting mothers throughout the stages of motherhood is something I hold close to my heart. I am also extremely passionate about my work with teen girls, especially those who struggle with academic pressures. I facilitate two girls' group each week that focuses on friendships, self-esteem, self-care, and coping skills for middle and high school.
I am trained in Emotionally Focused Therapy, a modality that helps couples restore intimacy and closeness by re-building loving and secure relationships.
Everyone has battles to fight and hurdles to overcome. Whether you struggle with anxiety, depression, self-esteem, marital issues, parenting concerns, or anything else--you should know that there is a better way to manage your life. Supporting mothers throughout the stages of motherhood is something I hold close to my heart. I am also extremely passionate about my work with teen girls, especially those who struggle with academic pressures. I facilitate two girls' group each week that focuses on friendships, self-esteem, self-care, and coping skills for middle and high school.
(747) 203-0897 View (747) 203-0897
Photo of Tannia Ben Zur, Marriage & Family Therapist Associate in Los Angeles County, CA
Tannia Ben Zur
Marriage & Family Therapist Associate, AMFT
Verified Verified
Calabasas, CA 91302  (Online Only)
Specializing in Children and Adolescents, Families, Couples, and individuals with a focus in , Coping skills , Self Esteem ,Stress , Anxiety ,Depression , Bullying, Phobias , Relationships , Leadership skills , and Play Therapy .
I believe we all possess the strength to overcome life's challenges. Partnering with a caring professional can help light your path as you embrace hope, healing and happiness. As a partner in your journey we will create change that reignites your light from within. My focus is to help you grow and become aware of your inner strength.
Specializing in Children and Adolescents, Families, Couples, and individuals with a focus in , Coping skills , Self Esteem ,Stress , Anxiety ,Depression , Bullying, Phobias , Relationships , Leadership skills , and Play Therapy .
I believe we all possess the strength to overcome life's challenges. Partnering with a caring professional can help light your path as you embrace hope, healing and happiness. As a partner in your journey we will create change that reignites your light from within. My focus is to help you grow and become aware of your inner strength.
(818) 740-7114 View (818) 740-7114
Photo of Alex Mirsakova, Marriage & Family Therapist Associate in Los Angeles County, CA
Alex Mirsakova
Marriage & Family Therapist Associate, AMFT
Verified Verified
Los Angeles, CA 90019
Do you ever struggle with feeling disconnected, like you don't fit in, or like you're watching the world happen around you from the outside in? Do you feel like you need someone to really understand you? To feel heard and unconditionally accepted in a space of your own? Above all, the most important aspect of therapy is the relationship we will cultivate together in session, which is in and of itself an invaluable tool. I value the concepts of authenticity, comfort and client autonomy in the therapy space. We will always go at your own pace. Where you go in that space, I will be there beside you.
Do you ever struggle with feeling disconnected, like you don't fit in, or like you're watching the world happen around you from the outside in? Do you feel like you need someone to really understand you? To feel heard and unconditionally accepted in a space of your own? Above all, the most important aspect of therapy is the relationship we will cultivate together in session, which is in and of itself an invaluable tool. I value the concepts of authenticity, comfort and client autonomy in the therapy space. We will always go at your own pace. Where you go in that space, I will be there beside you.
(818) 928-3621 View (818) 928-3621
Photo of Alice Elizabeth Kevork, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Alice Elizabeth Kevork
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA
Verified Verified
Pasadena, CA 91101  (Online Only)
I also work with couples who are facing difficulties with communication and other relational issues.
Is life too much to handle and it's triggering anger? Sometimes it feels that way... Would you like to reach the goals you once set? Are you ready to know more about yourself and do thing and solve problems like you once did but somehow it feels overwhelming now? Are you ready to thrive? You are in the right place. Call the number above for a free phone consultation.
I also work with couples who are facing difficulties with communication and other relational issues.
Is life too much to handle and it's triggering anger? Sometimes it feels that way... Would you like to reach the goals you once set? Are you ready to know more about yourself and do thing and solve problems like you once did but somehow it feels overwhelming now? Are you ready to thrive? You are in the right place. Call the number above for a free phone consultation.
(818) 724-9924 View (818) 724-9924
Photo of Cryssol Marquez, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Cryssol Marquez
Marriage & Family Therapist, LMFT, MA Ed
Verified Verified
Long Beach, CA 90807  (Online Only)
Experience working with clients experiencing domestic violence depression, anxiety, relationship issues, parenting, teen concerns, life transitions, and a wide range of challenges, including grief/loss, trauma, sexual and physical abuse and crisis as well as adjustment issues.
My experience is in community mental health and private practice with clients experiencing a range of challenges with life, relational issues and victims of crimes since 2013. Also, I collaborate with DCFS when applicable. I meet clients "where they are in their journey" and serve as a support for individuals progressing through their unique process of self-discovery and realization. We work collaboratively to meet your needs and reach your goals. I draw from the Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, Reality and Solution Focused Therapy.
Experience working with clients experiencing domestic violence depression, anxiety, relationship issues, parenting, teen concerns, life transitions, and a wide range of challenges, including grief/loss, trauma, sexual and physical abuse and crisis as well as adjustment issues.
My experience is in community mental health and private practice with clients experiencing a range of challenges with life, relational issues and victims of crimes since 2013. Also, I collaborate with DCFS when applicable. I meet clients "where they are in their journey" and serve as a support for individuals progressing through their unique process of self-discovery and realization. We work collaboratively to meet your needs and reach your goals. I draw from the Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, Reality and Solution Focused Therapy.
(323) 797-5860 View (323) 797-5860
Elena Gonzalez
Clinical Social Work/Therapist, LCSW
Verified Verified
2 Endorsed
Santa Monica, CA 90405
I believe in giving it to you straight wrapped with warmth and love. I believe we all have the power to make change but sometimes need a little help along the way. I provide individual, couples and family therapy to children, adolescents and adults. I have an array of experience from working to outpatient mental health clinics where I supervised psychology and social work interns to consulting at local schools to coordinating clinical programs. In addition I also enjoy weaving eastern and western philosophies into my practice.
I believe in giving it to you straight wrapped with warmth and love. I believe we all have the power to make change but sometimes need a little help along the way. I provide individual, couples and family therapy to children, adolescents and adults. I have an array of experience from working to outpatient mental health clinics where I supervised psychology and social work interns to consulting at local schools to coordinating clinical programs. In addition I also enjoy weaving eastern and western philosophies into my practice.
(424) 570-1067 View (424) 570-1067
Photo of Anja Stadelmann Wright, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Anja Stadelmann Wright
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA, LMFT
Verified Verified
Los Angeles, CA 90068
Exploring your life in partnership with a dedicated therapist can be a remarkable gift to yourself. I can help you gain insight into unhelpful patterns and difficulties in your life, and support you in realizing your hopes and goals. I view symptoms not merely as problems that need to be “fixed”; instead I seek to help you uncover their deeper causes. Problems then become opportunities for renewal and positive change. I believe a trusting therapeutic relationship is at the foundation of a successful therapeutic outcome. My goal is to provide a safe and collaborative environment in which lasting change and healing become possible.
Exploring your life in partnership with a dedicated therapist can be a remarkable gift to yourself. I can help you gain insight into unhelpful patterns and difficulties in your life, and support you in realizing your hopes and goals. I view symptoms not merely as problems that need to be “fixed”; instead I seek to help you uncover their deeper causes. Problems then become opportunities for renewal and positive change. I believe a trusting therapeutic relationship is at the foundation of a successful therapeutic outcome. My goal is to provide a safe and collaborative environment in which lasting change and healing become possible.
(323) 676-0072 View (323) 676-0072
Photo of Alicia Ramírez, Marriage & Family Therapist Associate in Los Angeles County, CA
Alicia Ramírez
Marriage & Family Therapist Associate, MA, AMFT, KAP
Verified Verified
Los Angeles, CA 90024
Areas of specialty include, but are not limited to trauma, anxiety, depression, relationship issues, life transitions, spiritual emergence, grief and loss.
I approach psychotherapy as a co-creative alliance between client and therapist. I seek to create a safe, humorous and collaborative space for clients to explore their own ability to access greater insight, clarity and self-awareness. I gravitate towards humanistic, psychodynamic and in-depth psychology (Spiritual) approaches - while also tailoring each session to my client’s particular needs and strengths.
Areas of specialty include, but are not limited to trauma, anxiety, depression, relationship issues, life transitions, spiritual emergence, grief and loss.
I approach psychotherapy as a co-creative alliance between client and therapist. I seek to create a safe, humorous and collaborative space for clients to explore their own ability to access greater insight, clarity and self-awareness. I gravitate towards humanistic, psychodynamic and in-depth psychology (Spiritual) approaches - while also tailoring each session to my client’s particular needs and strengths.
(310) 564-7130 View (310) 564-7130
Photo of Corey Hooper, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Corey Hooper
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA, MFT
Verified Verified
Pasadena, CA 91101
I specialize in working with individuals and couples who want to connect more deeply with their inner lives, dreams, and unrealized potentials.
As a psychotherapist and Jungian analyst, I will help you tap inner resources to better understand & deal with life challenges. We will explore who the 'you' is under anxiety, depression, fears, difficult relationships, and low self-esteem. As a Marriage and Family Therapist and analyst, I am flexible in providing the type of treatment best suited for each client, whether it is supportive when navigating difficult life transitions or analytic when exploring the inner dynamics of psyche and Self. During our work together we can explore how dreams, art, journaling, sandtray, & creative imagination play an active part in healing.
I specialize in working with individuals and couples who want to connect more deeply with their inner lives, dreams, and unrealized potentials.
As a psychotherapist and Jungian analyst, I will help you tap inner resources to better understand & deal with life challenges. We will explore who the 'you' is under anxiety, depression, fears, difficult relationships, and low self-esteem. As a Marriage and Family Therapist and analyst, I am flexible in providing the type of treatment best suited for each client, whether it is supportive when navigating difficult life transitions or analytic when exploring the inner dynamics of psyche and Self. During our work together we can explore how dreams, art, journaling, sandtray, & creative imagination play an active part in healing.
(424) 321-6493 View (424) 321-6493
Photo of Audrey S Johnson, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Audrey S Johnson
Marriage & Family Therapist, Psy, D, LMFT
Verified Verified
Calabasas, CA 91302
The areas of expertise are: addictions, marriage therapy, child/adolescent therapy. Additionally, We treat individuals, couples, and families with anxiety, depression, anger, domestic violence, all addictions, sexual and emotional abuse/neglect, low self esteem, bullying, failing grades, being oppositional, cutting, anxiety, depression, suicide, death of a loved one, and domestic violence. Additionally, there are two Associate Marriage Family Therapy interns that graduated from Pepperdine that work here, Doug May and Austin Johnson, that see clients that need low cost therapy starting at $50-80 and will be on insurance panels soon
The areas of expertise are: addictions, marriage therapy, child/adolescent therapy. Additionally, We treat individuals, couples, and families with anxiety, depression, anger, domestic violence, all addictions, sexual and emotional abuse/neglect, low self esteem, bullying, failing grades, being oppositional, cutting, anxiety, depression, suicide, death of a loved one, and domestic violence. Additionally, there are two Associate Marriage Family Therapy interns that graduated from Pepperdine that work here, Doug May and Austin Johnson, that see clients that need low cost therapy starting at $50-80 and will be on insurance panels soon
(818) 334-4743 View (818) 334-4743
Photo of Lisa Penny, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Lisa Penny
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA, LMFT
Verified Verified
I support families, couples, and individuals. Whatever the problem, challenge, trauma or pain, the power to change exists within you and your family. I believe that an effective therapist's job is to support a "shift," not to create it for you. Together, we can make progress toward your goals and desires. I am also trained and certified in hypnotherapy.
I support families, couples, and individuals. Whatever the problem, challenge, trauma or pain, the power to change exists within you and your family. I believe that an effective therapist's job is to support a "shift," not to create it for you. Together, we can make progress toward your goals and desires. I am also trained and certified in hypnotherapy.
(310) 990-9164 View (310) 990-9164
Photo of Shari Lynn Balbien, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Shari Lynn Balbien
Marriage & Family Therapist, LMFT, MA
Verified Verified
Calabasas, CA 91302  (Online Only)
Hi there and thank you for visiting my page! Are you ready to take control of your life and feel more empowered? The decision to enter into therapy is a brave and significant step in the right direction. Depression, anxiety, parenting challenges, unresolved trauma, and relationship conflicts can get in the way of living a truly fulfilling life. When we struggle, we oftentimes feel hopeless and weighted down. But there is always hope! I work alongside my clients to help address and improve family dynamics, marital conflicts, and parenting challenges to create a roadmap for more satisfying relationships and greater personal wellness
Hi there and thank you for visiting my page! Are you ready to take control of your life and feel more empowered? The decision to enter into therapy is a brave and significant step in the right direction. Depression, anxiety, parenting challenges, unresolved trauma, and relationship conflicts can get in the way of living a truly fulfilling life. When we struggle, we oftentimes feel hopeless and weighted down. But there is always hope! I work alongside my clients to help address and improve family dynamics, marital conflicts, and parenting challenges to create a roadmap for more satisfying relationships and greater personal wellness
(805) 900-4524 View (805) 900-4524
Photo of Zobra Hemphill-Ward, Marriage & Family Therapist Associate in Los Angeles County, CA
Zobra Hemphill-Ward
Marriage & Family Therapist Associate, AMFT
Verified Verified
Santa Monica, CA 90404
Are you or your child struggling with anxiety, depression, or behavioral issues? Have you found yourself feeling stuck or unable to create change? Therapy can help you cope with these challenges and set you up for future success. I find a positive and trusting client-therapist relationship to be the most essential component of the therapeutic process and place an emphasis on creating a safe and non-judgmental space for effective reflection and growth. Incorporating humanistic, mindfulness, and strengths-based approaches, I work with anxiety, depression, self-esteem, oppositional defiance, high-risk behavior, and family dynamics.
Are you or your child struggling with anxiety, depression, or behavioral issues? Have you found yourself feeling stuck or unable to create change? Therapy can help you cope with these challenges and set you up for future success. I find a positive and trusting client-therapist relationship to be the most essential component of the therapeutic process and place an emphasis on creating a safe and non-judgmental space for effective reflection and growth. Incorporating humanistic, mindfulness, and strengths-based approaches, I work with anxiety, depression, self-esteem, oppositional defiance, high-risk behavior, and family dynamics.
(424) 233-1039 View (424) 233-1039
Photo of Herbert Takhmazyan, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Herbert Takhmazyan
Marriage & Family Therapist, MA, LMFT
Verified Verified
Montrose, CA 91020
I offer evidence-based therapy for individuals, couples, families, kids & teens, addressing various concerns like behavioral issues, emotional challenges, and parenting struggles.
I am a psychotherapist specializing in depth-oriented therapy, helping clients who experience symptoms and behaviors with unconscious roots. By exploring the symbolic nature of these issues, we can uncover their deeper meaning and find solutions beyond surface-level interventions. I believe in the power of self-actualization and help clients overcome inner conflicts that hinder their potential. We work collaboratively to identify the underlying needs and develop a personalized treatment plan that may utilize various approaches, including solution-focused, cognitive-behavioral, and depth-psychological techniques.
I offer evidence-based therapy for individuals, couples, families, kids & teens, addressing various concerns like behavioral issues, emotional challenges, and parenting struggles.
I am a psychotherapist specializing in depth-oriented therapy, helping clients who experience symptoms and behaviors with unconscious roots. By exploring the symbolic nature of these issues, we can uncover their deeper meaning and find solutions beyond surface-level interventions. I believe in the power of self-actualization and help clients overcome inner conflicts that hinder their potential. We work collaboratively to identify the underlying needs and develop a personalized treatment plan that may utilize various approaches, including solution-focused, cognitive-behavioral, and depth-psychological techniques.
(424) 295-0811 View (424) 295-0811
Photo of Robyn Murakami Kim, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Robyn Murakami Kim
Marriage & Family Therapist, MS, MFT
Verified Verified
1 Endorsed
Torrance, CA 90503
I was born and raised in Honolulu, Hawaii, a melting pot of cultures and family values. I completed my Master of Science degree in Counseling (Marriage & Family Therapy) from California State University, Long Beach while training as a therapist with Shields for Families' School-Based Mental Health Program. I also have extensive experience working with community-based outreach programs. My upbringing and community-based involvement has informed my therapeutic work with children, adolescents, adults, couples, and families. Areas of special interest include play & art therapy, sand tray, dealing with trauma, anxiety, depression, pre-marriage counseling, and multicultural counseling.
I was born and raised in Honolulu, Hawaii, a melting pot of cultures and family values. I completed my Master of Science degree in Counseling (Marriage & Family Therapy) from California State University, Long Beach while training as a therapist with Shields for Families' School-Based Mental Health Program. I also have extensive experience working with community-based outreach programs. My upbringing and community-based involvement has informed my therapeutic work with children, adolescents, adults, couples, and families. Areas of special interest include play & art therapy, sand tray, dealing with trauma, anxiety, depression, pre-marriage counseling, and multicultural counseling.
(310) 893-0542 View (310) 893-0542
Photo of Mary-Jo Bautista-Bohall, Psychologist in Los Angeles County, CA
Mary-Jo Bautista-Bohall
Psychologist, PsyD
Verified Verified
Cerritos, CA 90703
Dr. Bautista-Bohall works with a variety of mental health issues and populations utilizing evidence based approaches with individuals, couples, and families.
Dr. Bautista-Bohall works with a variety of mental health issues and populations utilizing evidence based approaches with individuals, couples, and families.
(562) 521-9241 View (562) 521-9241
Photo of Lori Drozd, Marriage & Family Therapist in Los Angeles County, CA
Lori Drozd
Marriage & Family Therapist, MS, LMFT
Verified Verified
2 Endorsed
Diamond Bar, CA 91765  (Online Only)
Anxiety, Stress, Grief, Self-Esteem, Depression, Life Transitions, Relationship Struggles? I can help you identify and address your underlying or root issues in order to create an opportunity to move beyond just "coping" to creating a successful life.
Have you come to believe that you may never feel truly happy? Do you often feel invalidated and unappreciated? Are these feelings getting in the way of your ability to enjoy life? Sometimes we hang onto unconscious resentment from decades ago. These resentments can be part of our current mindsets, shaping who we are and affecting our level of well-being. I can help you take inventory of yourself and explore healthy ways to be happier and move forward in your life. I'm a compassionate, mature professional who will create a safe space for you to explore ways to feel better about who you are and how to feel happier with your life.
Anxiety, Stress, Grief, Self-Esteem, Depression, Life Transitions, Relationship Struggles? I can help you identify and address your underlying or root issues in order to create an opportunity to move beyond just "coping" to creating a successful life.
Have you come to believe that you may never feel truly happy? Do you often feel invalidated and unappreciated? Are these feelings getting in the way of your ability to enjoy life? Sometimes we hang onto unconscious resentment from decades ago. These resentments can be part of our current mindsets, shaping who we are and affecting our level of well-being. I can help you take inventory of yourself and explore healthy ways to be happier and move forward in your life. I'm a compassionate, mature professional who will create a safe space for you to explore ways to feel better about who you are and how to feel happier with your life.
(909) 345-8769 View (909) 345-8769

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Couples Counseling Therapists

Does couples counseling work?

Research shows that couples counseling is effective; it can reduce relationship distress and improve emotional awareness, communication, empathy, intimacy, and overall relationship satisfaction. For example, emotionally focused therapy was found to be effective for about 75 percent of couples, and those benefits lasted at least two years.

When should a couple seek counseling?

Couples can benefit from counseling if they consistently struggle in their relationship. They may have lost the ability to communicate effectively, become entrenched in harmful patterns, begun to fight more than usual, broken the other’s trust, suffered from a mental or physical illness, or faced any number of other challenges. Many therapists offer free consultations, so if a couple isn’t sure whether therapy is necessary, asking directly can provide clarity.

How can I get my partner to go to couples therapy?

The decision to seek couples therapy is often driven by one partner, who then convinces the other to participate. When discussing the idea, the initiator should be direct and assertive. They can state the problems they see and explain how the relationship would benefit from therapy. In more serious cases, they can also explain how their relationship may suffer without making any changes or seeking professional help.

How does a couple prepare for couples counseling?

The anticipation of beginning couples counseling can be difficult—sometimes more difficult than the first session itself. Taking a few moments to reflect can allay those concerns: What are the current challenges? When and how did they begin? What do they want the relationship to look like in the future? Reflecting on these questions can help individuals or couples articulate their goals. Of course, the therapist will also ask questions and guide couples through the process.