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So, Lambert has run smack into both the American hetero-homosexual double standard but also the lesbian-gay double standard. Read More
good points
FTR, I totally agree.
On a sort of related note, we just did a study finding that women find any sort of anal sex more disgusting than heterosexual sex, but that men only find male-male anal sex disgusting.
It seemed related when it popped into my head at least!
My 2 Cents
Though CBS might seem to have a double standard...they were right about not showing the "kiss". Why? Because Adam Lambert said the "kiss" wasn't planned...so that leaves me to believe he "forced" the kiss on his "straight" keyboardist...and that I would have to say would be considered assault. Same goes for the dancer who had his face "forced" into Adam Lamberts crotch. And since this happened while at work it seems like sexual harrasment to me. Just my 2 cents.
Response to My 2 Cents:
The straight male keyboard player was quoted saying that he had no problem with the kiss. And laughed about it. TommyLee must be a real openminded dude thank God for that. Wish some of the people posting here would be more open minded and just go about their business. Some of you seem so frustrated. You might want to get a social life as it may help your condition or maybe a boyfriend that might relieve the tension.
Typical hypocritical gays and their supporters
"... or maybe a boyfriend that might relieve the tension."
I find it hilarious when libs try to insult their opponents by calling them.....gay?!?! Every time I see that, I think to myself, "Gee, a Freudian slip?"
The fact that you liberals think you're insulting the guy by insinuating that he's gay shows that you know deep down that being gay isn't exactly normal.
P.S.-Now go ahead and personally attack me, libs. I'm waiting...
The above comment proves that
The above comment proves that conservatives will squander no opportunity to gay bash. Prevent them legalizing their relationships? Check. Fire them from their jobs? Check. Hound them from the workplace? Check. Spread any vicious lie about them, insult them, accuse them of destroying the family and every God given right that Baby Jesus gave us? Check. Beat them senseless and leave them to die on the sidewalk? Wow, where do I sign up?
And berate a hyper-talented singer with enormous potential of daring to do what scores of rock singers have done since Jim Morrison? Voila.
Conservatives hate. That’s their life blood. Hatred of liberals, of government, of minorities, the list is literally endless. Conservatives are ruled by mind numbing, all-encompassing, brain melting hatred. They search the world for enemies to hate. They will never be happy until America is a fascist state where they, and only they, rule.
I would suggest a move to a theocracy. I understand Saudi Arabia, Iran and Amish Country have available housing.
The above comment proves that liberals will bash conservatives
The above comment proves that liberals will squander no opportunity to bash conservatives. Misrepresent their political positions? Yes! Put words in their mouths so that they can knock down these straw men arguments? Yes! Prevent them from voicing dissenting opinions? Yes! Resort to name-calling and petty personal attacks? Yes! Exhibit the same type of intolerant behavior and hatred of which they claim others are guilty? Yes! Wow, where do I sign up?
And for the record, Adam Lambert is a good singer, but he's no more than a very talented karaoke singer. In other words, he's no Smokey Robinson or Frank Sinatra. (Watch, some liberal is going to claim that this is some sort of attack against gays--just watch!)
Liberals hate. That’s their life blood. Hatred of conservatives, of the free market, of religious people, the list is literally endless. Liberals are ruled by mind numbing, all-encompassing, brain melting hatred. They search the world for enemies to hate. They will never be happy until America is a fascist state where they, and only they, rule and where they can FORCE their views (ie; abortion, gay marriage, etc) on the rest of America.
I would suggest a move to a socialist country. I understand Canada, Holland, and Sweden have available housing.
The above comment proves that liberals will bash conservatives
The above comment proves that liberals will squander no opportunity to bash conservatives. Misrepresent their political positions? Yes! Put words in their mouths so that they can knock down these straw men arguments? Yes! Prevent them from voicing dissenting opinions? Yes! Resort to name-calling and petty personal attacks? Yes! Exhibit the same type of intolerant behavior and hatred of which they claim others are guilty? Yes! Wow, where do I sign up?
And for the record, Adam Lambert is a good singer, but he's no more than a very talented karaoke singer. In other words, he's no Smokey Robinson or Frank Sinatra. (Watch, some liberal is going to claim that this is some sort of attack against gays--just watch!)
Liberals hate. That’s their life blood. Hatred of conservatives, of the free market, of religious people, the list is literally endless. Liberals are ruled by mind numbing, all-encompassing, brain melting hatred. They search the world for enemies to hate. They will never be happy until America is a fascist state where they, and only they, rule and where they can FORCE their views (ie; abortion, gay marriage, etc) on the rest of America.
I would suggest a move to a socialist country. I understand Canada, Holland, and Sweden have available housing.
Even saying it twice doesn't
Even saying it twice doesn't make it so.
**In other words, he's no Smokey Robinson **
Smokey disagreed. Gave Adam a standing ovation.
Most liberals hate hate. Most conservatives hate hate. Not you, though. You're a free thinker.
Really? So a standing ovation
Really? So a standing ovation means that the person applauding believes that the person applauded is better than he/she? C'mon...
So when Kobe Bryant applauds a high school basketball player, it means he feels that the high school player is better at basketball than he is? Or when Obama applauds another head of state, he believes that he/she is a better leader?
Gimme a break...that's so ridiculous, it doesn't even pass the smell test.
Like I said earlier, Adam Lambert is a good singer. Much, much better than me. BUT, he is by no means anything special...other than the fact that he's gay. Heck, if anything, this guy has BENEFITED from being gay. Gays face ZERO discrimination in 2009 (much, much, much less than people of faith), and the comments on this website prove it.
Article or Fan War
I thought we were commenting on the content of this article. I didn't see anything about Adam's talent. This sounds like a fan war to me.
Adam and Tommy
Tommy Ratcliff kissed Adam Lambert back and he even sent a Twit on Twitter about it later on saying he got caught up in the moment with Adam and they both just went for it. It doesn't make Tommy gay in fact it makes him really HOT. A straight guy who is so sure of who he is and comfoftable in his own skin to know hey I can kiss this guy and make a statement and it will be okay because it is all in the name of rock...IS SEXY! Adam also went on interview and said he wouldn't have done those two things with those guys if they didn't have a good relationship. He said they all respect one another and neither of those things were suppose to happen. The dancer wasn't even suppose to be that close to him. But both of the other guys just went with it during the stage performances and no one had a problem with it. That is one reason why Adam is not just a performer, entertainer, singer; but also a business man. He surrounds himself with people he can trust, friends who become family and thus is protected.
Response to My 2 Cents
Actually, the dancer and the keyboardist were fine with it, in name of entertainment. Dancers were familiar with Lambert from the Zodiac Show (the most risky-edgy show on earth). The keyboardist had previously discussed with Adam that he would not mind being grabbed or "whatever" during performances. If you see a clip of "the kiss" it was reciprocated by the keyboardist.
Of course they say they are
Of course they say they are fine with it....now. I kinda feel like if they said they weren't fine with it they would probably get fired. Isn't that how sexual harassment works. I mean we're in a recession, no jobs to be found....so your boss cops a feel, no harm done...right?
Sorry you want the situation
Sorry you want the situation to fit into your sexual harassment idea, but it just doesn't.
The keyboardist is on the
The keyboardist is on the record as saying that he got a zillion twitter responses from girls who thought the kiss was HOT, so Tommy says that Adam can kiss him anytime!! So no one from the production is upset.
Adam has the best voice and his CD is amazingly great! If you'd give the CD a listen, you would get over all of this cuz the guy is really that that talented. The AMA performance just didn't allow us to see it. The sound was awful, but Mr. Lambert was GREAT on cbs' The Early Show on Wednesday 11/25/09! My entire family-all ages to tweens- love Adam and love this CD, For Your Entertainment.
My 2 cents as well
nothing was 'forced'. Tommy, the bass player (on keys for this song) said to the press he didn't mind at all, he thought it was funny and he'd do it again in the name of self expression. as for the dancer? most of them are friends of Adam's from his previous work in Hollywood, so that guy probably didn't care as well.
back to the article above. great read, and yes, there is a HUGE double standard. I'm curios to see what your magazine has to say about ABC dumping Adam and then hosting Chris Brown, a convicted felon, next week. his conviction? spousal abuse. he beat the crap out of his girlfriend.
violence against women is evidently ok, but an erotic stage show is not?
I'd rather watch Adam and Tommy go all the way than condone violence against women.
Excellent Read. Double Standards a plenty
What a fascinating read. I do find it disturbing that GMA allows a woman beater to come on, but will cancel a talented performer such as Adam. If anything his performance has opened the country up for a deeper conversation. The fact that it's okay for women to be seen as sexual objects, but not men...and the fact that women can get away with overtly sexual performances, but not men...unless of course you're a rapper or hetero rocker.
I applaud Adam for sticking to his guns, as he did nothing wrong. Last I checked, simulated oral relations don't affect the economy or global warming.
double standards alive and ugly
Adam has said he doesn't want to be the poster boy for Gay Rights but whether he knows it or not his first TV Music Awards performance just excelled the Gay Movement Forward. He has forced people to open their minds and think about this double standard. At work all the folks are talking about it during break, lunch, at the end of shift. More folks were talking about buying his CD just to listen to him and see what he is about. Of course you have those dead head closed minded homophobics who believe just being touched by a gay person will turn them. But for the rest it seems as if he is making them all see what he wanted to try to show with his performance. There is a double standard and for the most part only women were able to be blatantly sexual in their acts. I mean no one said anything about Janet Jackson grabbing herself, her dancer, pushing his head down or the fact that she pushed his head down so forcefully his butt was right up at her crotch. Didn't that simulate tossing salad? Or when she had the dancer kneeling at her crotch that wasn't simulating oral sex? I mean come on folks. At the begining of the AMAs Ms Jackson was doing all that and no one cared, no one called the PTC, no one called ABC and no one sent their kids to bed. But oh no...let Adam Lambert show the world he is openly gay or bi(because he did stuff with the ladies too) and the world is going to end. Oh wait no that is another project he just worked on. :-)
double standards alive and ugly
Adam has said he doesn't want to be the poster boy for Gay Rights but whether he knows it or not his first TV Music Awards performance just excelled the Gay Movement Forward. He has forced people to open their minds and think about this double standard. At work all the folks are talking about it during break, lunch, at the end of shift. More folks were talking about buying his CD just to listen to him and see what he is about. Of course you have those dead head closed minded homophobics who believe just being touched by a gay person will turn them. But for the rest it seems as if he is making them all see what he wanted to try to show with his performance. There is a double standard and for the most part only women were able to be blatantly sexual in their acts. I mean no one said anything about Janet Jackson grabbing herself, her dancer, pushing his head down or the fact that she pushed his head down so forcefully his butt was right up at her crotch. Didn't that simulate tossing salad? Or when she had the dancer kneeling at her crotch that wasn't simulating oral sex? I mean come on folks. At the begining of the AMAs Ms Jackson was doing all that and no one cared, no one called the PTC, no one called ABC and no one sent their kids to bed. But oh no...let Adam Lambert show the world he is openly gay or bi(because he did stuff with the ladies too) and the world is going to end. Oh wait no that is another project he just worked on. :-)
Hiprocacy at it's finest
There is one point that wasn't brought out in this article but I agree with the article 100 percent. Here's the real double standard that lurkes in the darkness and privacy of the bedroom.
1. Fact - millions of heterosexual couples practice sodomy and oral sex regularly, but usually don't tell.
2. Fact - these practices are also done at orgy's which are kept somewhat hidden from friends, families and coworkers.
3. Fact - There are millions of men I know quite a few who claim to be heterosexual have homosexual desires curiosity and their frustration comes across as "hating" the behavior of homosexual men. Surpression of these desires can cause unwarranted and sometimes out of control anger toward gay men in defense of their own surpressed feelings and desires. This is also caused by lack of knowledge about cause of homosexuality. Education is the best way to change minds.
4. Women who are heterosexual are more accepting of gay men because gay men are easier to have as friends, most women feel they can share their most intimate feelings w/o fear of condemnation. Married women on a large scale are unhappy with part of their marriage due to their spouses not communicating or addressing their needs, feelings or sexual desires.
My comments are based on some of my own personal experiences and my clinical practice experiences working with unhappy married couples.
I forgot to add.. Adam's
I forgot to add..
Adam's performance was tame compared to other performers that night and in the past. Why are most of the negative articles blowing up the whole performance as porn, disgusting and all the other OTT descriptions. It's all about cashing in on the publicity and not by Adam's team by most of the media. These kinds of articles draw many mean spirited, haters and just weak minded people who have no life but to sit in the houses 24/7 and spew vile all ove the internet and make calls to ABC. What do these people really expect to happen. What a waste of time. The only one's suffering are ABC and any other network that cancel's Adam's appearences. ABC is now known as the network that "caved", 'throwing Adam under the bus' and was cowardly in their decision. CBS and NBC are supporting ADAM. ABC's worst nightmare isn't Adam it's their own bad business decision. From what I am reading they have received emails, calls and letters saying they have lost thousands of viewers due to the cancellation. I don't care if they end up apologizing, I will protest that network for the rest of my life not because of Adam's situation alone but because ABC's managment team has no dignity or respect for what the public really wants to watch. Censorhip at it's finest. That was one three minute performance which millions enjoyed and didn't react like the so called 1500 complainers. Of course we'll never know if they were really offended or if they were the fans of another celebrity/idol on a mission. I supposed some were from the Right Wing Conservative establishment but who really cares because they think they have to be the eyes and ears of all Americans. That group is dying in our society and no longer have any clout and they know it. They are so desperate that they are trying to destroy everything in there path.
general reactions
Well, these are a group of particularly thoughtful comments, with a few exceptions -- much unlike the stomping I took at the hands of Limbaugh's clack a few weeks ago.
However, would someone please explain "GOP Thinker"'s charge "I find it hilarious when libs try to insult their opponents by calling them.....gay?!?! Where exactly did that occur?
Yes, negative reactions tend to be overrepresented in mail and in other communiques to networks. ABC's tally was typical. Although I read in a comment elsewhere that it was particularly difficult to get through complain to ABC after the event. That could hsve suppressed response rat, both positive and negative.
Generally, however, positive reactions to ahows and show "surprises" are fewer because positive reactors are usually less highly motivated to "do the work required" to make their voice heard than are the outraged viewers.
So, if you love somebody, let them know--their sponsors as well.
As for anal sex preferences and perceptions, results don't surprise. Wouldn't the same results for men apply to oral sex --at least in theory? In practice my guess would be that "don't ask-don't tell, don't know, don't mind, would pass muster.
Finally, I think yes, woman beaters are and would be invited on a talk show or for dinner faster than gays in most settigs. This speaks to the status on so many dimensionsof both demos in our (and many other)cultures.
Check the comments, Stewie
Hey Stewie, try checking the comments next time. I was replying to a person who said this to a guy who disagreed with her:
"...maybe a boyfriend that might relieve the tension."
This is a typical tactic of gay marriage supporters. They accuse their male opponents of being "in the closet", which undermines their whole argument that there's "nothing wrong with being gay." Like I said, Freudian slip???
As for the double standard, I agree that there is most certainly a double standard here. The solution? Keep Adam Lambert AND Chris Brown off of Good Morning America. Neither one of them have shown good taste. OTOH, your solution is to keep both of them front and center because in your view there is no such thing as tasteless.
More than a white, Christian country
Dr. Fischoff said this was a white, Christian, heterosexual country and the values that have been expressed are of that majority. I totally agree. I will add that the power still lies in the hands of MALE, white, Christian heterosexuals. I believe that there is not quite the uproar about women kissing women or blatantly displaying their sexuality because men like women kissing women and blatantly displaying their sexuality.
This controversy is about sex; both the act and the gender.
power
mend, yes: white, Christian, MALE, heterosexuals. Amazing that I overlooked that.
The hypocracy is American, not global
Being German, I did a little research into what my birth country was writing about this. There seems to be the consensus that it's pretty ridiculous of Americans to make such a big deal of this.
In fact, in this article there was a mention that the simulated oral sex picture can't be found as a still photo. Here it is in a normal weekly German magazine:
http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/leute/0,1518,663266,00.html
'Der Spiegel' is a well respected magazine, that writes about all kinds of stuff - not Entertainment oriented, but more political and global.
oral sex photo
Thank you, Michaela. I've edited my blog accordingly. Yes, America's cultural envelope for sex and erotica is rather narrow, especially when compared with its envelope for aggression.
Much of Europe is quite comfortable with with the reverse polarity. Of course, "the Continent" wasn't settled by the Puritans.
Girl Porn
Hey it was a bit of porn---Girl Porn. I am bored watching girls kiss but tolerate it because it excites my male partners. I think a lot of women now understand why it turns on guys because watching two good looking guys kiss was a turn on. Is that what is annoying all the men (who I assume are most of the media execs out there)? Girl-Girl common and boring. Guy-Guy new and surprising. Sex is fun people, enjoy. Let's talk about aggression--if Adam had kicked the guy in the groin and smashed Tommy in the face would we even be having this conversation?
Girl Porn
Hey it was a bit of porn---Girl Porn. I am bored watching girls kiss but tolerate it because it excites my male partners. I think a lot of women now understand why it turns on guys because watching two good looking guys kiss was a turn on. Is that what is annoying all the men (who I assume are most of the media execs out there)? Girl-Girl common and boring. Guy-Guy new and surprising. Sex is fun people, enjoy. Let's talk about aggression--if Adam had kicked the guy in the groin and smashed Tommy in the face would we even be having this conversation?
Ewwww is about gay men and what they do with their naughty bits
I've lived with a number of gay men over the years. On the surface they found straight aversion to what they do with their penises amusing--but on the inside their feelings were hurt.
I also have known many lesbians and in real life they NEVER look like 2 straight girls kissing--that's mainly for the straight porn crowd. Those pictures (like the one in this article) always leave out the "top" or the "butch" woman.
At any rate, there is no penis (well, except for strap-on ones) in lesbian sex and therefore very little sense of EWWWWWW or danger. Except if you see the real thing, maybe. Sex gets pretty raunchy no matter how you slice it!
With gay guys its all-the-way EWWWWW for the straight community. I think it's because of the penis and what that means in the gay sex act (penetration of something).
Straight guys seriously don't like what that image conjures!
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