The classics are always true, because despite technological change,
political change, people basically are always the same. The ways of being
frightened are limited; there are no new ways. There are no new ways of
falling in love. The way to understand life is to go directly to the old
stuff and see what's in it that you haven't noticed before.
PT: I imagine you don't have much use for a therapeutic approach to
life, a psychoanalytic approach to life.
PF: It depends on whether it's credible. I have no respect for
chemical therapies of any kind, depending upon pills to cheer you up or
to make things seem more significant. It's got to be intellectual or
spiritual -- in the form of language, not chemistry Not mechanical. As long
as they don't oversimplify human experience or human awareness.
We're beginning to see how Freudian psychology has simplified the
complexities of the brain and of awareness. When I was 25, Freudian
analysis seemed the way to solve every personal problem. It was popular
because it was expensive and, therefore, seemed exclusive and was
associated with New York City But it didn't usher in the new emotional
world at all. It was broadcast as something universally true and useful,
which it has proved not to be.
PT: Would you say that's because so many human problems are
essentially unsolvable?
PF: Yes. And we should see that as the beginning of wisdom. They're
not totally unsolvable, but they're not solvable in the simple-minded
form that is frequently argued for.
PT: Do you think the therapeutic approach poses the danger of
becoming self-absorbed or too focused on the self?
PF: Yes. Egotism is the ultimate human sin. To care too much about
yourself and your own ideas and your own program causes people to be
blind to the infinite number of other programs that are available out
there.
PT: You always seem to defy what people expect.
PF: Exactly. Because I found out that I could get away with it. I
did this even in college. Before the war, I was a C-student and spent
most of my time drinking beer and horsing around. After the war I spent
all my time at being a good student, at reading everything I hadn't read
before, redeeming myself in one sense. Going to graduate school, becoming
a teacher -- that had been unheard of before the war.
I'm an example of what can be done if you care a lot about it. The
lack of talent doesn't matter as much as the lack of willpower.
Sacrificing everything to the object in view: that becomes harder to do
every moment because of all this stuff flowing in from outside. I notice
how many people can't think unless the radio is on. They don't know how
to concentrate, which is the simplest avenue to distinction of any
kind.
PT: You haven't tried to please people and yet you've been very
successful.
PF: Yes, but I have learned, largely from studying the behavior of
artists and authors, of how little importance wanting to please people is
to significant achievement. Michelangelo didn't go around kissing ass. He
set to work on his marble. And stayed up late to serve the artistic end
he had in view.
PT: So it's a product of willpower.
PF: Anything of value
intellectually is accomplished by a single, lonely person doing it
whether it's popular or not, resisting advice of all kinds.
Art is what we have instead of religion. It requires of us the same
kind of single-minded, single-hearted devotion -- that's not the wrong word,
devotion -- to an object we recognize as more valuable than
ourselves.
It's lonely. You have to have a great deal of -- it sounds as if I'm
flattering myself -- intellectual courage. This kind of courage isn't often
recognized.
PT: If you had one piece of wisdom to impart, what would it
be?
PF: Do something that you respect. If you can avoid writing ads
designed to deceive people, or false news reports, or the celebration of
the worthless, you can't help but augment your self-respect. And then
you'll probably be happy.
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